The KCC Forums

It will be interesting to see where the interests move re: AT in the next while. Conservative towns like Kamloops tend to pick up to some degree on the right-wing trends. At this time that leans towards anti-data, anti-expert, anti-change, anger driven decision making. I am hoping that the huge and obvious oversteps in the USA give the Canadian conservatives some pause about going that far down the same road. Not sure.

I responded to an article posted by David Johnson re 6th avenue bike lane. The article was a pretty typical rant. My response:

The City just spent $3.4 million to add an extra turning lane onto Pacific Way. I believe the City is paying for all of that and some of it through long term debt. That is only one of a great many vehicle centred projects this year. So, yes your grand daughter is going to inherit debt but bike lanes aren’t going to be much of it.

There are issues with the 6th Avenue bike lane in that it can be argued that it is overbuilt. However, it isn’t an issue of not needing a bike lane, rather it really is an issue of connectivity which was much too casually dismissed by Mr. Johnson. We could argue 6th vs 5th Avenue forever, but really the problem is the bike path ending at Lansdowne. Council decided to not approve a bike lane on Lansdowne, noting it would remove a few centimetres of width from the vehicle lanes, so here we find ourselves. A road to nowhere until additional Active Transportation infrastructure is built out. That may happen when the Performing Arts Centre is built so don’t damage our options before that by spending a lot of money to remove the lane.

Cycling in Kamloops became a much more viable option for many with the rise of the eBike. It essentially flattens the city so the trail in Peterson Creek (Xget’tem Trail) isn’t just one way or limited to Tour de France cyclists. However, most people considering riding a bike, need to be separated from traffic to feel safe. It doesn’t help that cars are on average a foot wider than they were in 2013 and the F150 is longer that a World War 2 Sherman or Panzer tank. It doesn’t help that the average SUV driver can’t see a child in front of their car in a parking lot. It doesn’t help that the maximum legal speed limit isn’t even the minimum socially acceptable speed. Hence the need for separated bike lanes, and, YES, build a connected system and it will be used.

Regarding the quip about cyclists running red lights. The scale of this issue is a true urban myth, especially compared to drivers. Multiple studies have shown that cyclists break fewer laws than drivers and I am not aware of a study suggesting otherwise. One large study using cameras at intersections showed about 5% of cyclists breaking laws when on bike paths and 14% when not on bike paths. However, an earlier study showed that 66% of drivers were found to be breaking laws. The myth comes from bad driving behaviour being normalized and thus not noticed while bad behaviour from ‘others’ stands out.

Finally, we often say we want a ‘family friendly’ city. Don’t separated bike lanes move in that direction? Wouldn’t it be nice for a family to be able to cycle to City events or even for kids to cycle to school? Is that so bad?

I asked about the Overlander sidewalk at the AT Public meeting last night. I wondered if it was deliberately terrible to slow down cyclists. It was suggested it was just bad construction. As a note, the William Bennett bridge sidewalk between Kelowna/West Kelowna is just as bad but much longer ... and some engineering company proudly put up a sign to let everyone know they built it.

Anyway, nice to know it will be smoothed ... but it won't be wider.

Found it. I added ..

​First, don't put in an MUP where an existing painted bike lane already exists (e.g., Valleyview). Go with the 'quick build' option that city Councillors liked that use curb barriers. Aside from the cyclist/pedestrian issues, moving cyclists further from the street encourages drivers to make right hand turns across the paths of cyclists at every cross street (signs indicating cyclists have right-of-way are good but drivers don't notice them). An MUP makes every intersection more dangerous. Where ever there is currently a painted bike lane, we need curb edging (quick build). Usage will greatly increase.

Second, when you get to the stage where you might be ready to draw up blueprints, check with cyclists (e.g., Kamloops Cycling Coalition) about the details. We USE these streets everyday and know the details and hazards. A check at this stage could improve safety by an order of magnitude (e.g., McGill/Columbia intersection ... current plan fails to address a major hazard and barrier to use that could be fixed with 50m project extension to the Frontage road accessing Starbucks).

Third, the AT gap between the Notre Dame/Summit intersection and McGill is a major barrier for AT access from Upper Sahali/Aberdeen to TRU.

Fourth, think about access to shopping so that AT can be used for more than just commuting.

Fifth, the need for AT access between ValleyView and Dallas is huge. A cyclist was killed just a few years ago using the highway to bridge this gap but all cyclists and pedestrians have absolutely no choice but to use the highway shoulder. I use this when I cycle out east and don't recommend it for anyone without experience.

Sixth, don't build a new MUP where a parallel residential/quiet road is readily accessible. e.g., Fortune vs Shubert. Take advantage of adjacent residential/quiet roads. Just add traffic calming such as speed bumps or better yet one direction access on each block for vehicles (e.g., St. Paul/Nicola). Residents love one direction access as it reduces traffic on their streets and makes it a joy to cycle. Kids can even play on the streets ... and it has to be cheaper by far.

I have booked the Big Little Science Centre

Hi Trent,

when you say you used 'Let's Talk,' was that under the 'Ask a Question' option on the Active Transportation page? I don't see this there.

Anyone know what the bike parking is like at the Sandman?

Do we know anyone who uses the Valleyview corridor daily? We need that detail. I use it about once a month to head out east for a ride.

Trent, Bryce, did either of you attend a meeting since Xmas? I think it was just the one meeting that I attended and I don't recall any discussion on 'refinement.'

The final meeting of the engagement group did occur a couple of months ago (I attended). Basically the City brought the engagement group together over a year ago, led a group cheer, and then called everyone back when Staff had settled on a plan. The problem with the lack of genuine consultation seemed to be due to the departure of an energetic and very strong AT advocate on Transportation Staff. His loss led to Staff wandering aimlessly for a year. We are all frustrated. The plan isn't terrible but it doesn't address some real needs (e.g., access to shopping) and could have doubled in utility if they had consulted us on the details.

There is no question that the default for the City is the Multiuse Path. It would require direction from Council to shift that thinking and KCC has been asking about how we might do that. While the new Active Transportation Plan notes the quick build infrastructure, I don't see that being the primary build unless the City Staff discover a way to make it zero cost and zero impact on road lanes and parking. We are a very low priority. Having said all that, there are situations when I would take a MUP over the current infrastructure. As crazy as it seems to have a MUP with high pedestrians and possibly high cyclist use going to TRU along McGill, the current situation is going to get someone (me?) killed sooner or later. Sooo many close calls ...

Hi Neil,
we didn't get into the weeds. Basically two themes:
1)what is the current support for Active Transportation on Council?
2)what could be done to improve that?

This was from Aaron Wiebe. He sourced t-shirts for TRU from All about Imprint. This sourcing was pre-tarriffs/Trump-nonsense when being Canadian wasn't the primary factor but rather ethically sourced. Aaron asked for t-shirts that came from 'B-Corp' accredited sources. You can learn about that at:
https://www.bcorporation.net/en-us/certification/

I think we would need to ask specifically about non-US sourcing for KCC. Cotton could only be grown indoors in Canada and I am not aware of anyone doing that. However, non-USA sources must be available.

No problem. Looks like the choice of weekend could use a touch more consideration next year. We have a fair number of conflicts with other events and street cleaning efforts by other organizations

As of Thursday night it looks like they are around 90% done. Interesting that Pacific Way hasn't been done yet, just because it gets SOOO MUCH sand and gravel over the winter. Not a bike route of any value though.

They have done my home street as well in Aberdeen. I'm not sure if they have purchased more sweepers but it seems they are getting it done faster overall. A couple years ago it seemed to be weeks after they started on the N Shore before they got to Aberdeen.

I just sent two to your gmail

Looking good to take a few photos today (Sunday). 10:00 am at the bottom of the Xget'tem trail (Peterson Creek). It's a 'Go.'

Okay, sorry about that. It does look decent this morning but tomorrow still looks good in the forecast. Confirm Sunday morning at 9.

Yeah, they are running through Aberdeen today. It was pretty weird on Hugh Allan, as you note it was as if they hit capacity as soon as they started and just rearranged the debris.